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FrivYeti
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Well, I just learned a fun one.

Cards placed underneath the Dreamer on her The Dreamer Wakes are not indestructible, which means that End of Days wipes them out and places them in the trash.

That was a fun way to lose a Mint on the latest one-shot. 

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FrivYeti wrote:

Well, I just learned a fun one.Cards placed underneath the Dreamer on her The Dreamer Wakes are not indestructible, which means that End of Days wipes them out and places them in the trash.That was a fun way to lose a Mint on the latest one-shot. 

Ah, yes.  I've done that.  Fortunately, in my case I was saved by the Ongoing-destroying projection, which takes out End of Days before it can destroy the cards under Dreamer.  Which as a bonus also protects all the hero cards from being destroyed.


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Arcanist Lupus wrote:

 

FrivYeti wrote:
Well, I just learned a fun one.Cards placed underneath the Dreamer on her The Dreamer Wakes are not indestructible, which means that End of Days wipes them out and places them in the trash.That was a fun way to lose a Mint on the latest one-shot. 

 

Ah, yes.  I've done that.  Fortunately, in my case I was saved by the Ongoing-destroying projection, which takes out End of Days before it can destroy the cards under Dreamer.  Which as a bonus also protects all the hero cards from being destroyed.

Yes, noticed both of these on my last play through this - not enough to save the game, but something to keep in mind for the next play through.

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It turns out that for someone who never wields a gun, Mr. Fixer is a crack shot in the Shooting Gallery.

 

In fact, he's quite good at handling many of the attractions at Madame Mittermeier’s, provided he's holding his trusty Jack Handles.  You Won't Believe Your Eyes, but Mr. Fixer doesn't care, he's blind.  He's not going to Vanish without a Trace either, and he doesn't find the Carousel so Horrifying.   


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Nothing game breaking but a nice combo for two variants, at least to me, that don’t see much play.  If you have DW Setback in turn order before F6/Golem Unity and he uses Mitigate bots now cost two self damage for Unity which is certainly more appealing me to than four damage allowing you to get more use out of the power before health gets concerning.  


Crush your enemies, drive them before you, and laminate their women! - Guise, Prime Wardens #31

 
Roger the Alien
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It was probably already mentioned but I love Mr. Fixer with his Dual Crowbar and Grease Monkey Fist which lets him deal 3 damage to the first target and 5 damage to a second target. 

Sometimes there is no second enemy target but if you have AZ with Null-Point Calibration Unit on the field let Mr. Fixer deal cold damage with his Grease Monkey Fist and heal AZ every turn. 

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Or hit AZ with fire and get him to hit the target, too.

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Dude Mr. Fixer with Crowbars, Grease Monkey Fist, and Harmony, and Absolute Zero (fully set up, with Coolant Blast) is ridiculous!

Mr. Fixer hits AZ with fire, then hits an enemy with MORE fire. Then AZ either hits himself for cold, or hits that enemy again. With Overdrive or Charge (or Overdrive and Rod of Anubis, even better!) you can really rack up the damage, without leaving AZ any worse for wear.

Then on AZ's turn, use a one-shot like Frostbound Drain or Hoarfire, and let loose with Coolant Blast for MASSIVE damage!


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The Wraith, Unity, and The Naturalist are great. Have out Unity's Stealth Bot (making sure it is the hero target with the lowest HP), Wraith's Smoke Bombs, and Naturalist's Formidable Rhinoceros and Resilient Hide (making sure Naturalist is the hero target with the highest HP). Whenever a villain target tries to deal damage to a hero target, have it redirect to Stealth Bot, which triggers Smoke Bombs and redirects to Naturalist whilst reducing the damage by 1. Damage deal to Naturalist is already reduced by 1, and if the net amount is 1 Resilient Hide prevents it. Thus any damage of 3 or fewer from the villain side is no more. This gets further improved with Bestial Shift (another damage-1) and Indomitable Force (another damage-1 and non-villain damage dealt to hero targets can also get redirected to Naturalist, albeit without Smoke Bombs' effect).

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LewdDolphin21 wrote:

The Wraith, Unity, and The Naturalist are great. Have out Unity's Stealth Bot (making sure it is the hero target with the lowest HP), Wraith's Smoke Bombs, and Naturalist's Formidable Rhinoceros and Resilient Hide (making sure Naturalist is the hero target with the highest HP). Whenever a villain target tries to deal damage to a hero target, have it redirect to Stealth Bot, which triggers Smoke Bombs and redirects to Naturalist whilst reducing the damage by 1. Damage deal to Naturalist is already reduced by 1, and if the net amount is 1 Resilient Hide prevents it. Thus any damage of 3 or fewer from the villain side is no more. This gets further improved with Bestial Shift (another damage-1) and Indomitable Force (another damage-1 and non-villain damage dealt to hero targets can also get redirected to Naturalist, albeit without Smoke Bombs' effect).

 

Throw in a Wraith Stun Bolt or two for even more reduction!

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I often use Wraith with Visionary or Nightmist if I want to be Smoke Bomb happy. When they become invulnerable, (Telekinetic Cocoon or Mistform) I'll ping the health of the rest of the heroes so they are all tied for lowest. Then Smoke Bombs makes everyone in the party invulnerable to villain damage. But it's not great if you summon minions. (Unity, Captain Cosmic) Throw in Parse for some deck control to avoid ongong destruction and the game can end up in a lock for the heroes.

Lately though, Legacy and Captain Cosmic give me all the tanking I need. Throw all the Energy Bracers on Legacy and Legacy will tank all the villain damage of 6 or less without a scratch. (thanks to Superhuman Durability, Fortitude and Lead from the Front)

 

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Well, here's a new one, although maybe it's less "Unexpected combinations" and more "really obvious thing that I never clued in to":

If Guise borrows one of Argent Adept's instruments, he can activate songs that are still in AA's play area. Instruments don't care where the songs are. This seems obvious from the literal card art, but I'd never thought of it so I never tried before...

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Sooooo, entering a Fixed Point in time allows flip side Mad Bomber Blade to recruit minions and/or find Mobile Defense Platforms. Funny that.

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FrivYeti wrote:

Well, here's a new one, although maybe it's less "Unexpected combinations" and more "really obvious thing that I never clued in to":If Guise borrows one of Argent Adept's instruments, he can activate songs that are still in AA's play area. Instruments don't care where the songs are. This seems obvious from the literal card art, but I'd never thought of it so I never tried before...

Ohhhhhh. Well, I never caught on to that. I just thought, "Man, that's hard to copy Argent Adept when I have to use his instruments and his songs."

 

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Well I just learned that abilities that target decks (Rogue KNYFE's power was what I noticed it with) can target the Title Deck.  It makes sense, but that's not something I would have considered as a possibility playing on the tabletop.

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Interesting. You can search for a title you want.

...or a mission you want, I'm guessing. Could Super Scientific Tachyon get two mission cards in play?

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Trajector wrote:
...or a mission you want, I'm guessing. Could Super Scientific Tachyon get two mission cards in play?
The mission deck doesn't have a play area, and cards that come from it get "moved," not "played."  And there's no mechanism for moving mission cards not on their deck or in a hero play area.  So even if you could, all it would do is lock those two cards into an unusable limbo area.

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Got slaughtered by one the other day that perhaps shouldn't have been unexpected.

Fighting Omnitron with a team that included Absolute Zero. About halfway through, I played Sub-zero Atmosphere.

But Omnitron's on the Self Aware Robotics Factory side, so it's "end of turn" activity is to shuffled trash and play a component. And it draws the Electro-Pulse Explosive.

Since it's still the start of the villain turn, EPE goes off, and every hero takes 15 damage.

Ouch.

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EPE is not a valid item to come into play as Omnitron only plays a card with the Component or Drone keyword from trash.   The EPE only has the Device keyword.  


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Omnitron probably just played the top card of its deck at the start of turn. Not a great villain to use Sub-Zero Atmosphere against!


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That certainly is the other case.   Sub Zero Atmosphere can be great in some setups and downright terrible in others.   


Crush your enemies, drive them before you, and laminate their women! - Guise, Prime Wardens #31

 
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So I was going to ask about strange things. Was playing about with some of the old weekly one-shots and Ultimate Baron Blade made it to 15 cards at the start of his turn due to Subzero atmosphere but didn't win the game. Is that because the order the actions resolve is check, then discard? 

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The check happens first per the order of the card text.  A similar case is Voss with Forced Deployment out and he has ten minions in trash. The check and the minions coming into play happen at the start of turn but the check on Voss’s Card occurs before Forced Deployment triggers. 


Crush your enemies, drive them before you, and laminate their women! - Guise, Prime Wardens #31

 
Demiher0
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Ah ok was resolving it correctly on the table as well.

I also just realized that you can lose to Ultimate Baron Blade by flipping him if you are very very unlucky. 

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Impulsion Beam + Gritty Reboot.  Whenever you draw a card, you take damage.  Whenever you take damage, you draw a card.  You can keep trade as much HP as you want for cards.

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Random game I was playing recently tweaked me onto this combo:
Omnitron-X + KNYFE, with KNYFE having Focusing Blade out and up to the 3 other copies in hand. If OX plays Singularity (Destroy X Equipment, deal X to all non-heros) and destroys Focusing Blade, KNYFE can play another copy immediately to get blown up again and so on. Nice way to add a little extra damage to the AoE nuke.

~Komori

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Nice! You can do a similar thing with Construct Cataclysm and Sustained Influence.

I just had this happen:

Baron Blade had a Living Force Field on the board, so Sky-Scraper played a Neutralizing Resonator for next turn. She was last, and the environment, Omnitron IV, quietly played a lone Resource Recycler. On Baron Blade's turn, he whipped up a Backlash Field.

Wraith used an Infrared Eyepiece on her turn to reveal another Living Force Field and a Devious Disruption. Great! I pick the lesser of two evils, thinking that Portja can at least get rid of one damage reduction.

Sky-Scraper's turn starts. I get the option to destroy an Ongoing card and blow up the Force Field. Then a bunch of things zoomed around my screen and I got ANOTHER option to destroy an Ongoing card. I had to rewind to figure out what happened: the Neutralizing Resonator got destroyed and went into the top of Sky-Scraper's trash, where the Resource Recycler promptly put it into play again. It auto-played onto the villain character card without my input, and then, since it was still the start of turn, it could trigger again to explode the Backlash Field!

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Trajector wrote:

 It auto-played onto the villain character card without my input, and then, since it was still the start of turn, it could trigger again to explode the Backlash Field!

Ha! Ha! Ha! That's great!


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So with 380 posts, it's hard for me to find time to read through everything to see if someone already posted this... but I just had a fun one that I thought I would share.

Matriarch in Madame Mittermeier's. She has no environment destruction... and Maze of Mirrors came out... and her birds spent the rest of the match KOing themselves by flying into mirrors.

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That is so satisfying...

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X-treme Prime Wardens Fanatic against (solo) Plague Rat is a lot of fun. She's even more fun if the team involves Setback and he has both copies of "Friendly Fire" in play. She pummels the ever-loving crap out of Plague Rat.


Kupo.

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I assume you mean that she can re-direct the Infection damage to Plague Rat. Similarly, when she tries to hit Setback with Friendly Fire, that gets redirected to Plague Rat as well. I think that since this is an “unexpected combos” thread, it’s helpful to spell out exacly how the combo works.

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Just beat Ultimate Blade, although not sure if this is working as intended - in Final Wasteland with Unforgiving Wasteland out, he got killed by environment on front side which let me remove him from the game and get the win. Assuming it IS working as intended, nice combo with any of the “hits lowest” monsters (which aren’t exactly in short supply!)

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That is intended.  


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yayeahyeah
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Powerhound_2000 wrote:

That is intended.  

Awesome, thanks!

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I used Guise and played „I can do that too!“ https://imgur.com/a/t0rhKfX

I copied the base power of the Hunted Naturalist to draw a card and the crocodile was chosen „snap snap“ https://imgur.com/a/VFRPAmK

The Hunted Naturalist had Cornered Beast in play https://imgur.com/a/XfIGCe1

The Bonus of Cornered Beast was doubled https://imgur.com/a/7mEgLQR

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That doesn't look right.  Cornered Beast should apply only once even if both The Naturalist and Guise count as crocodiles.  Even if "Uh, Yeah, I'm That Guy" were also in play, it would only benefit Guise once and Naturalist once.


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Working correctly. Both Guise and The Naturalist activate the crocodile text on Cornered Beast, giving The Naturalist +2 to damage. Worth noting also is that both Guise and the Naturalist activate the crocodile text on Uh Yeah, I'm That Guy, giving Guise +2 to damage.


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I thought Uh, Yeah was supposed to destroy Form cards when you copy the Naturalist. <.<

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Doesn’t mean Naturalist can’t put the Form back into play.  


Crush your enemies, drive them before you, and laminate their women! - Guise, Prime Wardens #31

 
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TakeWalker wrote:

I thought Uh, Yeah was supposed to destroy Form cards when you copy the Naturalist. <.<

But the Hunted Naturalist's base power doesn't have that problem.
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Well, I tried it with Uh Yeah and Resilient Hide, and I don't understand what happened at all: at the start of Guise's turn, both he and Naturalist gained a hit point.  The log said that the Naturalist got his from Resilient Hide directly, and Guise from Uh Yeah, but that doesn't make sense, since Resilient Hide shouldn't have triggered until Naturalist's turn.  I would have understood if Uh Yeah gave Guise two hit points (one from each rhinoceros), based on the above example, but this I don't get.

Also, why does it work for ongoings, but not one-shots?  I would expect that if both Guise and Naturalist can trigger the same symbol on the same ongoing, they would also trigger the same symbol on the same one-shot.  I haven't tried it on Natural Form's Power yet, but I honestly have no idea what to expect given the pattern so far.


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Is it because the rule, as written when you F3 to check out what's happening, is "The Naturalist may activate {animal} effects"?

Like, it doesn't matter who's playing them. If they're there, they can be activated.

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But even then, Resilient Hide when copied by Guise reads, "At the start of your [Guise's] turn, Guise regains 1 HP."  The Naturalist shouldn't be gaining HP on Guise's turn.  And if ongoing clauses with the crocodile symbol happen twice if there are two crocodiles in play, I don't know why that doesn't apply to one-shots.

If anything, that logic is the reverse of what's happening.  No text in the game says "Guise may activate [Crocodile] effects," but when he's a crocodile, they're activated regardless of who they belong to.

I referenced the Vengeance rulebook where it explains how The Naturalist works, but unfortunately, it's clearly wrong (it only talks about playing cards, not cards that are already in play).


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MigrantP
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Resilient Hide has a rhino text that says "At the start of your turn, The Naturalist regains 1 HP."

At the start of Guise's turn, he activates the rhino text on Resilient Hide, so The Naturalist regains 1 HP, exactly as the card says.

Uh Yeah has a rhino text that says "At the start of your turn, Guise regains 1 HP."

At the start of Guise's turn, he activates the rhino text on Uh Yeah, so Guise regains 1 HP.

It doesn't apply to one-shots because Christopher said it doesn't apply to one-shots. Not sure why you're claiming that Guise couldn't activate the effects. In the example above, he used I Can Do That Too! on the Hunted Naturalist, so he can activate the effects.   The change to how The Argent Adept and The Naturalist work with Guise was posted in the update notes to the last version. Here's the link again for reference: http://handelabra.com/blog/2018/4/27/sentinels-2511-bug-fix-release

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Yeah, I understood how he worked with Argent Adept.  That's easier to understand because there aren't any passive effects.  I never considered that the original copy of Resilient Hide would check every hero to see if they happen to be a rhino, and if so, heal The Naturalist at the start of that hero's turn.  That's really weird and unintuitive.  I get the logic, but boy is that something that no one will ever play right in tabletop.

Now I'm imagining Guise parading around in a really awful rhino disguise and persuading all the enemies to attack The Naturalist, who is in Gazelle form but has Indomitable Force out.


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If I’m understanding it correctly, it works because “Uh Yeah” also copies Rhino, and Rhino doesn’t care which hero has cards with Rhino text.

Uh Yeah reads “Guise may activate Rhino effects. If Guise takes exactly 1 damage, prevent that damage. Rhino: At the start of your turn, gain 1 HP.”

The first phrase is what activates Resilient Hide on the Naturalist, and the “gain 1 HP” phrase copied to Uh Yeah.

Of course, this implies that on the Naturalist’s turn, his copy of Rhino activates the Rhino text on Uh Yeah. I haven’t tried this.

EDIT: Several cards display Guise’s shape-shifting abilities, including Uh Yeah. So I imagine that if he’s being a Rhino, he’s definitely a Rhino, the same way he has substantial pecs on Uh Yeah and Guise the Barbarian. It’s just that it’s a purple Rhino that’s recognizably Guise.

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Gus_Smedstad wrote:

If I’m understanding it correctly, it works because “Uh Yeah” also copies Rhino, and Rhino doesn’t care which hero has cards with Rhino text.Uh Yeah reads “Guise may activate Rhino effects. If Guise takes exactly 1 damage, prevent that damage. Rhino: At the start of your turn, gain 1 HP.”The first phrase is what activates Resilient Hide on the Naturalist, and the “gain 1 HP” phrase copied to Uh Yeah.Of course, this implies that on the Naturalist’s turn, his copy of Rhino activates the Rhino text on Uh Yeah. I haven’t tried this.EDIT: Several cards display Guise’s shape-shifting abilities, including Uh Yeah. So I imagine that if he’s being a Rhino, he’s definitely a Rhino, the same way he has substantial pecs on Uh Yeah and Guise the Barbarian. It’s just that it’s a purple Rhino that’s recognizably Guise.

The Rhino came from "I can do that, too"
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That's why this is so hard to track, you've got two separate things doing kind of the same thing but not really. x.x

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Minor annoying one from this week's one-shot:  Imbued Fire + activated Flesh of the Sun God + XTREME Fanatic.  She cannot redirect her self damage, because she is immune so it just fizzles.

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