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Rules question, rouse the spirits

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rampsnakes
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Rules question, rouse the spirits

Lets say rouse the spirits comes out on the event card (every spirit with 3+ dahan on their lands may use a slow power now), and when resolving it you find that you have a serpent slumbering wtih at least 3 dahan but another spirit that doesn't have 3+dahan. If serpent allows that spirit to place prescence via his innate due to rouse the spirits and after using said innate the other spirit has enough dahan, do they then get to use the rouse the spirits effect as well? Also after typing this I realized that there are slightly less contrived ways to do this, like using a power that pushes dahan to acheive the same effect.

Ameena
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I would say that yes, you can do that (isn't it four or more Dahan, though, not three or more?), considering once one spirit has finished activating one of their powrs, the Event is still ongoing so you'd move onto a different spirit and check their Dahan total - if it's enough to let them use a power at that point (regardless of whether or not it was before the first spirit acted), I would say that's fine and they can then use a power if they wish. Like the "simultaneous actions aren't really simultaneous" thing in Sentinels.


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dpt
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That's my instinct too. But I'm not sure, and I pinged the designer.

(It's correct that almost nothing is simultaneous; the only exception I can thing of are some instances of damage being dealt.)

Eric R
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Sorry for the slow reply - strangely, this question hadn't come up before, and it sets a precedent so I wanted to think about it for a bit.

The general rule (now) is: When the game tells you "For each [thing that meets conditions], do [some action]", you first note which things meet the conditions, and then do the action on each of those things (in an order of your choosing, unless otherwise specified). I.e., the actions don't change which things met the conditions.

So the specific answer in this case is: no, in order to use Rouse the Spirits, a Spirit must have 3+ Dahan in its lands at the start of the Dahan Event.

If anyone knows of / notes any established rulings which run counter to this general rule, please let me know so I can reconcile them!

(While in general I like to err on the side of permissiveness / cool combos, making the general rule be "re-evaluate conditionals after each action" has the potential to open up a bunch of unintended side effects - e.g., an Event which said "In each land with 2 or more Towns, Push 1 Town" could be used to Push a Town to a land with another Town, then Push it again, possibly all the way across the island. Plus, Invader Actions already work in this "Find all matching lands, then resolve them" way (this isn't formally laid out, but the Jagged Earth rules will do so), and the consistency is good.)

dpt
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added a FAQ. I couldn't find another instance (besides Invader Actions) where it matters, so the FAQ is not very general.

TakeWalker
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When you make that theoretical Town-push event comparison, this sounds like the reasonable way to do it.

carnilius
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To clarify, I'm assuming the converse of this also true?  If conditions are met for a spirit before any actions are taken, but are no longer met before the action for that spirit, that spirit still gets to perform their action as the condition was true at the check.  Correct?

dpt
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Can you be more specific with your question?

carnilius
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So, using the example in the original question, if two spirits both have 4+ dahan in their lands, and the first one uses a power which results in the second spirit no longer having 4+ dahan in their lands, I'm assuming that given this ruling they would still be able to use a power.

Lorkenpeist
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Yes, you would first check which spirits have sufficient Dahan, then each such spirit can reap the benefits,  even if they no longer have sufficient Dahan, because you don't keep rechecking the conditions.